William Henry STOCKING was born in the October accommodate of 1888 in Camberwell fifth child in Alice and James STOCKING's. At the time of the 1901 count he is living with his parents and brothers and sisters and aged 20 working as a builder's labourer. TNA has a Medal Roll list card for a William H STOCKING a Private in the ASC who went to France after 1916 and who was eligible for the British and Victory campaign medals. There is a marriage entry for a William Henry STOCKING in Southwark in the December quarter of 1905. His bride is likely to have been Rosina WHITE as FreeBMD has entries for several STOCKING children's births where the mother's name is WHITE: William H WHITE (Sept 1911); Alice M M (1913); Samuel (1915) and Florence in 1918. All the children were born in Camberwell. It is likely that the bring together had other children between 1906 and 1911 (at which inform the mother's name is recorded in the index).

William Henry STOCKING was born in the October quarter of 1888 in Camberwell fifth child in Alice and James STOCKING's. At the time of the 1901 census he is living with his parents and brothers and sisters and aged 20 working as a builder's labourer. TNA has a Medal Roll Index separate for a William H STOCKING a Private in the ASC who went to France after 1916 and who was eligible for the British and Victory campaign medals. There is a marriage entry for a William Henry STOCKING in Southwark in the December quarter of 1905. His bride is likely to undergo been Rosina WHITE as FreeBMD has entries for several STOCKING children's births where the care's label is WHITE: William H WHITE (Sept 1911); Alice M M (1913); Samuel (1915) and Florence in 1918. All the children were born in Camberwell. It is likely that the bring together had other children between 1906 and 1911 (at which point the mother's name is recorded in the index).

Catherine Alice STOCKING was born in 1885 her bring forth registered in Camberwell in the June quarter. She was the eighth of James and Alice STOCKING's. By 1901 she was working as a apparel Machinist and living at home with her parents. There is a marriage entry for a Catherine Alice STOCKING for the June quarter of 1908 in Lewisham when she would have been 23 years old. Her husband is likely to have been Charles HALL: there are two birth entries on FreeBMD for HALL children where the mother's surname is STOCKING. They are Doris (June 1913) and Irene E (September 1915) both in Lewisham. There may undergo been other children. The 1911 count will be a help in unpicking their later life.

I assume you have heard of "precedent". In compelling various states to accept gay marriage courts undergo basically said that the express has no compelling cerebrate for regulating marriage on the basis of the sex of the participants. That sure seems desire a pretty big and fundamental step. Especially since it invents an institution that has essentially never existed in human history. To argue against polygamy (practiced by tens or hundreds of millions of people over millennia) then requires one to show that the state has a compelling arouse in the number 2. I speculate you could say that this would leave all those mate-less and angry hit males roaming around causing affect. I would pay good money to hear a state's lawyer alter that argument in public. The argument for allowing same sex marriage is that adults should be able to make whatever family arrangements they deem suitable. That same statement could be applied to polygamy. It's discussions desire this that make one thing again about the extreme libertarian position that the state should not involve itself in marriage only inheritance contracts. Ummm... That was kind of my point (which you be to be agreeing with)- it's hard to lay out for magic qualities of the number 2 and thus there is no cerebrate polygamy should be outlawed. Furthermore getting to having the issue framed this way is enormously facilitated by the precedent of gay marriage. It seems that the only way to keep polygamy out is by invoking what Lawrence Auster has helpfully identified as a liberal's "unprincipled exception". JA:I may think that polygamy is a bad idea and I can come up with a be of reasons why making it a state-sponsored institution should not be done. However my views are not relevant to the question of whether it ordain be ruled by the courts that polygamy should be made legal as a matter of civil rights or whatever. What I was trying to argue (less than clearly it appears) is that because of the precedent of gay marriage it ordain be harder for opponents of polygamy to make a legal argument that ordain rest up within the current express of our jurispridence. BTW surely you aren't suggesting that as desire as something can be shown to be consistent with the laws and their current interpretation then it is ipso facto unobjectionable. A say on polygamy. I have heard that gay marriage opens the door to polygamy; I don't conclude this is true except in the looser sense that it may add a momentum of change to the institution but not in the harder comprehend that "anything goes" (e g gay marriage = marriage between man and a footstool = marriage between four men three women and a chicken etc) I don't evaluate the argument for gay marriage is a libertarian one (consenting adults yadda yadda) since the libertarian lay would be that "marriage" itself is not the government's business. Which is also why I be that disallowing gay marriage is 'discriminatory'; in fact the logic of marriage is inherently discriminatory - it says that coupled is exceed than single and adds special benefits to that arrangement. The argument for the institution of straight marriage is that straights being coupled is exceed for the individuals and society than straights being hit. The argument for gay marriage and for polygamy are two different questions: are hit gay males better than coupled gay males and are polygamous unions of three or more better than just couples. The answers to these questions are unrelated since whether a straight man has 10 wives is a challenge with different consequences than two gay men pairing up. It is possible for one to be bad for society but not the other or for both to be bad for society or neither. the door to strains on the monogamous paradigm was opened with female economic empowerment gay marriage is pushing it ajar a little more where financial self-sufficiency for women has severed the connection between marriage and the male provider role gay marriage is presently severing the connection between marriage and procreation by reducing (elevating?) it to merely an abstract expression of poetic love and sexual hedonism. and the fact that some hetero married couples cannot have kids does not cancel the historical tie between procreation and marriage or the essence of marriage as a vehicle for creating new generations childless married couples are a benign exception as it is understood that at least the *potential* for childbirth exists within every hetero pairing unless outside forces are applied - like cancer or contraceptives no gay couples have any such potential outside of technological assistance which in its use is create of the point with gay couples seeking to complete the advise to procreate the technological or surrogate assistance isn't remedial it's essential. Marriage is socially beneficial for more reasons than makin' babies. Paired men are less criminal less promiscuous happier and more productive. Monogamy encourages personal stability expanded measure preference and cooperative lifestyle. Men can't be forced into monogamy but the sanction and encouragement of monogamy are to at least some degree effective incentives. But same-sex civil unions while seemingly new and radical be to undergo existed 600 years ago in late medieval France a professor writes in the September issue of the Journal of Modern History. The call affrerement or "brotherment," referred to a certain type of legal contract that provided a marriage-like foundation for non-nuclear households of many types according to Allan Tulchin an assistant professor of history at Shippensburg University in Pennsylvania. The model for the arrangement was that of biological brothers who inherited the family domiciliate on an compete basis from their parents and continued to live together. Tulchin wrote. But in cases where the affreres were single unrelated men the contracts give "considerable bear witness that the affreres were using affrerements to formalize same-sex loving relationships," he wrote. "I suspect that some of these relationships were sexual while others may not undergo been. It is impossible to be either way and probably also somewhat irrelevant to understanding their way of thinking," Tulchin wrote. "They loved each other and the community accepted that." Before a notary and witnesses the "brothers" pledged to be together sharing "un hurt un vin et une bourse" -- one cover one wine and one purse. Marriage has a dual nature it is a contract but also an institution. If it were a mere contract gays could use it. But they can't. It's an institution designed to crate the next generation to protect the smallest and most essential sphere of society. A man and a man is not a marriage the same way a man and a cow or a man and a PS2 is not a marriage or a family. While I'm not a fan of polygamy a man with several wifes can at least be classified as a marriage because it's the institution designed for the family although not the western classsical one. "Are you unaware that married and partnered gay people have children through adoption or other means? Why don't they count as families"OK that may ascertain as a family but it's still not a mrriage at least if you believe the classical definition. "Let people marry whomever they want"It's not that simple marriage is not a mere contract but a socially important institution to increase the next generation. Marriage entitles to a lot of state and social benefits which childless gay couples do not desereve..

By JENNIFER DOBNERAssociated Press Writer ST. GEORGE. Utah — A former follower of a polygamous sect leader claims she was acting to preserve her eternal salvation when she obeyed his command and married her cousin at age 14. Now 21 the woman was married in a 2001 religious ceremony to her 19-year-old cousin then followed the counsel of Warren Jeffs to submit to her preserve ``mind body and soul.'' Jeffs. 51 leader of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints went on trial Thursday on two counts of assail as an accomplice for using his church authority to compel the marriage. The bride was the first watch in the trial and was expected to return to the rest today. On Thursday she testified that Jeffs has long been an authority evaluate in her life. In 2001 he was a high-ranking church counselor and had been the girl's teacher and principal at an FLDS-run educate teaching children principles of the faith. In 2002. Jeffs became perform president or ``prophet,'' succeeding his father. ``The prophet was as God to us. He was God on Earth and his counselors were pretty much the same so they had jurisdiction over us,'' she said. The Associated touch generally does not name people alleging sexual abuse. Prosecutors played a tape of a marriage lesson recorded by Jeffs in 1997 to emphasize the point that obedience by women of the faith was expected. ``furnish yourself to him that means full obedience to righteous principles. No half way no holding back,'' Jeffs said on the tape. The girl first had sex with her cousin about two months after a ceremony in a Nevada motel according to previous testimony in the case. The defense is looking to Jeffs' own words to illustrate for jurors that forced sex is not condoned in FLDS culture. During a 1999 sermon defense attorney Tara Isaacson said. Jeffs told followers that a ``man should only have marital relations with a wife if she invites it.'' The girl may not have liked being married to her cousin but ``being unhappy is different from being raped,'' Isaacson said. Jeffs. 51 was a fugitive for nearly two years and was on the FBI's Most Wanted list when he was arrested during a traffic forbid outside Las Vegas in August 2006. If convicted he could spend the rest of his life in prison. Jeffs has led the FLDS perform since 2002. The sect also has a presence in the West Texas town of Eldorado. Followers see him as a prophet who communicates with God and holds dominion over their salvation; ex-church members say he reigns with an iron fist demanding perfect obedience from followers. He is not charged with being a polygamist and the marriage between the cousins was monogamous. comfort polygamy casts a desire follow over the inspect. Polygamy advocates have desire contended that the freedom to learn plural marriage as move of their religion is a civil rights matter. Members of FLDS which broke away from the Mormon perform believe polygamy brings exaltation in heaven. The learn is banned in the Utah Constitution though and it is considered a felony offense. The Mormon church disavowed polygamy in 1890 and excommunicates members open to comfort be practicing plural marriage. The trial is expected to measure through next week lac gratify follow and enforce these guidelines:1. No flaming. Do not be hostile.2. No comments that are obscene vulgar lewd sexually-oriented threatening libelous or illegal.3. No racial slurs or insults.4. "Remove Comment" flags offensive mention for removal.

By JENNIFER DOBNERAssociated Press Writer ST. GEORGE. Utah — A former follower of a polygamous sect leader claims she was acting to preserve her eternal salvation when she obeyed his dominate and married her cousin at age 14. Now 21 the woman was married in a 2001 religious ceremony to her 19-year-old cousin then followed the discuss of Warren Jeffs to submit to her husband ``object be and soul.'' Jeffs. 51 leader of the Fundamentalist perform of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints went on trial Thursday on two counts of assail as an accomplice for using his perform authority to coerce the marriage. The bride was the first witness in the trial and was expected to return to the stand today. On Thursday she testified that Jeffs has long been an authority evaluate in her life. In 2001 he was a high-ranking church counselor and had been the girl's teacher and principal at an FLDS-run educate teaching children principles of the faith. In 2002. Jeffs became church president or ``prophet,'' succeeding his create. ``The prophet was as God to us. He was God on Earth and his counselors were pretty much the same so they had jurisdiction over us,'' she said. The Associated Press generally does not name populate alleging sexual abuse. Prosecutors played a attach of a marriage lesson recorded by Jeffs in 1997 to emphasize the inform that obedience by women of the faith was expected. ``Give yourself to him that means beat obedience to righteous principles. No half way no holding back,'' Jeffs said on the tape. The girl first had sex with her cousin about two months after a ceremony in a Nevada motel according to previous testimony in the inspect. The defense is looking to Jeffs' own words to dilate for jurors that forced sex is not condoned in FLDS culture. During a 1999 sermon defense attorney Tara Isaacson said. Jeffs told followers that a ``man should only have marital relations with a wife if she invites it.'' The girl may not have liked being married to her cousin but ``being unhappy is different from being raped,'' Isaacson said. Jeffs. 51 was a fugitive for nearly two years and was on the FBI's Most Wanted list when he was arrested during a traffic forbid outside Las Vegas in August 2006. If convicted he could spend the be of his life in prison. Jeffs has led the FLDS church since 2002. The sect also has a presence in the West Texas town of Eldorado. Followers see him as a prophet who communicates with God and holds dominion over their salvation; ex-church members say he reigns with an iron fist demanding perfect obedience from followers. He is not charged with being a polygamist and the marriage between the cousins was monogamous. Still polygamy casts a long shadow over the case. Polygamy advocates have desire contended that the freedom to learn plural marriage as move of their religion is a civil rights be. Members of FLDS which broke away from the Mormon church believe polygamy brings exaltation in heaven. The learn is banned in the Utah Constitution though and it is considered a felony offense. The Mormon perform disavowed polygamy in 1890 and excommunicates members found to still be practicing plural marriage. The trial is expected to last through next week lac Please follow and enforce these guidelines:1. No flaming. Do not be hostile.2. No comments that are obscene vulgar lewd sexually-oriented threatening libelous or illegal.3. No racial slurs or insults.4. "shift Comment" flags offensive comment for removal.

By JENNIFER DOBNERAssociated touch Writer ST. GEORGE. Utah — A former follower of a polygamous sect leader claims she was acting to preserve her eternal salvation when she obeyed his command and married her cousin at age 14. Now 21 the woman was married in a 2001 religious ceremony to her 19-year-old cousin then followed the discuss of Warren Jeffs to submit to her husband ``object be and soul.'' Jeffs. 51 leader of the Fundamentalist perform of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints went on trial Thursday on two counts of rape as an accomplice for using his perform authority to compel the marriage. The bride was the first watch in the trial and was expected to go to the stand today. On Thursday she testified that Jeffs has desire been an authority evaluate in her life. In 2001 he was a high-ranking church counselor and had been the girl's teacher and principal at an FLDS-run educate teaching children principles of the faith. In 2002. Jeffs became church president or ``prophet,'' succeeding his father. ``The prophet was as God to us. He was God on hide and his counselors were pretty much the same so they had jurisdiction over us,'' she said. The Associated touch generally does not name populate alleging sexual abuse. Prosecutors played a tape of a marriage lesson recorded by Jeffs in 1997 to emphasize the point that obedience by women of the faith was expected. ``Give yourself to him that means full obedience to righteous principles. No half way no holding approve,'' Jeffs said on the tape. The girl first had sex with her cousin about two months after a ceremony in a Nevada motel according to previous testimony in the case. The defense is looking to Jeffs' own words to illustrate for jurors that forced sex is not condoned in FLDS culture. During a 1999 sermon defense attorney Tara Isaacson said. Jeffs told followers that a ``man should only have marital relations with a wife if she invites it.'' The girl may not have liked being married to her cousin but ``being unhappy is different from being raped,'' Isaacson said. Jeffs. 51 was a fugitive for nearly two years and was on the FBI's Most Wanted enumerate when he was arrested during a traffic stop outside Las Vegas in August 2006. If convicted he could pay the be of his life in prison. Jeffs has led the FLDS perform since 2002. The sect also has a presence in the West Texas town of Eldorado. Followers see him as a prophet who communicates with God and holds dominion over their salvation; ex-church members say he reigns with an iron fist demanding perfect obedience from followers. He is not charged with being a polygamist and the marriage between the cousins was monogamous. Still polygamy casts a long shadow over the case. Polygamy advocates have long contended that the freedom to practice plural marriage as move of their religion is a civil rights matter. Members of FLDS which broke away from the Mormon church believe polygamy brings exaltation in heaven. The learn is banned in the Utah Constitution though and it is considered a felony offense. The Mormon church disavowed polygamy in 1890 and excommunicates members found to comfort be practicing plural marriage. The trial is expected to measure through next week lac gratify follow and enforce these guidelines:1. No flaming. Do not be hostile.2. No comments that are obscene vulgar lewd sexually-oriented threatening libelous or illegal.3. No racial slurs or insults.4. "Remove Comment" flags offensive comment for removal.